Wes Capper: 100 Fights and Building The Barn

This transcript was generated automatically and lightly edited for readability. It may contain minor errors, and speaker labels are not yet added. I didn't finish but I got suspended like a couple of days in the school. I got a little bit in a little bit of a scuff at school and just never went back. I progressed quite well in competing and fighting and stuff and I had the opportunity to kind of go over to Europe and then fight in Thailand and stuff. Instead of holding me back a little bit, they kind of sign me off early and I just got to go and chase me thing and do that there.

I feel like most fighters are half decent people. Yep. the facade that they maybe carry or even like just the aura that they have may seem like they're a dick. All right, so today guys um obviously pretty informal like always.

I got Wes Capper here from The Barn. Uh how long you have the barn for, dude? This year in September will be 8 years. Have you always been in that same spot in Balcatta?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Cool.

So, um I've probably known Wes, I don't know, probably similar like just um maybe the Eternal Days and then obviously come over to the barn on and off a couple of times boxing and um couldn't wait to get him on. I'm going to give him because he was meant to bring his airplane hat and uh he's been under the pump this week. Uh a few coaches and that down, but that's all part of business. But, uh the check in in 6 months, I'll make sure he wears his little airplane hat.

Cool. She usually walks into the cage or the ring or the wind, don't you? What's the story behind it? Let's start with that.

What's the uh Do you want the full story of that? Yeah, it. Let's go, mate. I got I was 18 years old and I'd had a couple of fights here.

And then we went for a fight over in Queensland on the Gold Coast. Uh it was called Warriors of the Cage or something it's called. And uh I was just fighting over there and I'd only had a handful of fights and then my coach at the time had said, "Yeah, you'd be fine with this guy, you know." Yeah, he's just a bit of a standup guy. I was like, "Okay, sit.

No worries." And then pretty much we walk around the $2 markets there like on the Gold Coast and then there we come across like a wig store and there's a few other guys from the same gym that were fighting on that card. So there's like a there's a Brazilian, there was like an African guy and there was like a Russian guy. It's quite strange mix of those and they all tried different hats on, you know, like Xavier put on like a Jamaican hat, you know, cuz he was black and Gustavo wore this big massive wig thing. Who the he Brazilian?

And then um Alex, it's like a Russian who was a big Russian hat. So he found and then I just put on that propeller hat with the the little propeller on it. And then yeah, they were like, "Yeah, wear that. Wear that tomorrow night when you fight blah blah blah." And I was just like, "Okay, I'll wear it." And then yeah, I won.

I won by uh submission and I thought you know what this might be a good little thing to do little good little good little good little good little good Oh have you really since then? Yeah. How long ago was that? I was 18.

Maybe nearly 19. What are you now? 37. That's cool.

So it has been with you a long time. I didn't know that. Long time. It's not the original hat.

The uh ring announcer from Melbourne. I remember his name a second. He flicked it one time after I'd won. He was I got to do it.

And then he flicked it, but then he broke the little membrane mechanism and the whole all the bits fell on the floor. So I do have the original one of that and it's at home. It's actually covered in blood cuz I' been cut and splattered a few times. But I got a few other replica ones that I just pretty much have at home just in case.

But you know. Yeah. Cool. Got to have your pieces with you.

Want to crack the crack a start. Yeah. Cool, man. I didn't know that story.

That's good. So tell us about the start of the barn when you started 8 years ago. was pretty much only kind of being bullied by a friend of mine. Who's that?

Uh his name is Mark Bell. He's a I don't know if he still owns a law firm. Anyway, I was one of the main coaches for PCR which is the corporate boxing event. Yep.

Cuz I was working at another gym at the time and I was kind of floating in and out cuz I'd had a contract in America. So I was kind of living in America for 3 4 months at a time. Then I come back for a little bit at that point. At that point.

So then when I was coming back on my stints here, I was uh just pretty much just working wherever I could. So that's 2018, sorry about it. Yeah. Yeah.

Give us eight. Probably a little bit 17 16 17. Yeah. Yeah.

So then I was Yeah. working at another gym, taking classes there and then um yeah, I end up become one of the main instructors or coaches for that event. And then you meet obviously a different array of people through that event. And then I met Mark and then he just kind of noticed that the times that I was back, you know, the classes that I was taking at that time, say the morning classes, you know, they were getting, I don't know, five to six people.

And then after a few weeks of me taking, it was close to, you know, 20 people in the class. So, you know, he kind of rang light to me and said, "Hey, man, like you're helping build someone else's business right now and you look like you're passionate and you enjoy enjoy it. What do you want to do?" and I was like, I don't know what I knew that I wanted to do that. I just like I just I am passionate about it and I enjoy it and it's been a big part of my life.

Uh yeah, it was nice that he and I just kind of he honestly just pushed me over the edge and it was I appreciate that a lot. You know, put a lot of pressure on me and made me feel uncomfortable, but I definitely grew from that's the growth, right? So, I was happy that he did that and then yeah, progressed and rolled on and like any business, it's been ups and downs and it's difficult and it's it's a constant constant grind as it always is. I can't get punched in the face forever.

So, yeah, that's true. Yeah. Doing over 100 fights, man. You're not going to keep doing that for forever when you get older.

No, my body's starting to for now. So, so just just on that just your business window at the moment and then I'll jump back to something else. So um obviously the journey is a roadblocks risk and resilience that I I could only picture you that moment and we all know you would have been what 26 27 I think worked out me head the business roughly 8 years ago it's close to 30 oh 30 where 29 what are you now 37 yeah so somewhere there anyway but when you're in your 20s and you might not have done it so it's really cool that someone close to you had that you know believed in you and and seen that passion man that's it's so that's such a good feeling cuz most people are about themselves right and just natural Not in a bad way, but when someone comes and pushes you, that's pretty cool. It's uh if I could make any relation to that, it' be like fighting in the ring or occasionally the concept of I mean, I've gone through different a few different teams and and people being involved in my life and career in that regard.

And as corny as it sounds, you know, you're you're going into battle with someone. You know, I think it takes a special person regardless of what they're doing to willingly go in and try and combat another man. You know, that that's that's harder than it looks. You know, it is difficult.

So having a team or even people behind you that truly believe in you and want to back you that is a total you can see the total represent rep representation of that in the fighter when they feel really backed with the people that are behind them. So that's how I would relate to her in that regard. That's cool. That's really cool.

Going into battle you can see even in times I mean I've been around a little bit longer now. So, it's like you can see it in fighters that you can tell don't really have a lot of trust or their team aren't really the good match for them. You can see it in their performance last minute. Yeah.

You can see the you can see that or you can see teams that are you can tell see they're tight and you're like that's that's it. So, when you when you walk in or you're getting ready out the back I don't know a lot about outside my pay grade but like but you know you got that team in the room with you. You're doing all your prep. You're doing you know we always watch the hands getting wrapped in that like that.

That's a real team shot from someone like me on the outside. Yeah, I mean that's the that's the end of the crop of it. It's more it's the weeks before. Yeah, talking about like months before they've been How long do you start fight camp out usually?

Unless it's unless you throw yourself under the bus last minute. Uh you generally want to try and do 12. Yeah, anywhere between I mean if you're in half decent nick, you should be okay. If you're starting like dead from scratch Yeah.

I'd probably dead. I'd probably say 12ish, but if you're staying in pretty good shape and I was I meant 12 weeks out. Oh, yeah. 12 weeks.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. A few months out.

So, what did I say? Months. No, no, no. You didn't say anything.

I was just clarifying. 12 weeks out. Uh, that's probably a good gaugement, give or take. I mean, but if you're in half a nick and you're ticking over and staying seller relatively active.

Yep. Yeah. Yeah. Yep.

In some less. Well, while while we're on the subject, I was going to go back back before you when you started the business, but we'll do that in a minute. Tell tell us a bit about the fight camp when you go into it. And actually, you know what?

Let's go back because it depends what what discipline you're going as, right? No, this is this is one thing I had in my head to ask you. Where did you start? Was it kickboxing?

No. Started MMA. Oh, it was MMA. I started with like grappling essentially.

Da tell us about that. When was that? Uh I I started like doing I wanted to do MMA. Yep.

And that was I live I grew up in in New South Wales in in Penrith. Oh, in Penrith. Okay. I'm from the roof.

Yep. Uh, and I did uh some MMA classes at Fit for All. Tyson Pedro, you know, Tyson Pedro used to be in the UFC. His dad used to run the classes.

Oh. Yeah. So, I remember doing those classes when I was like 15, 16. And it was just like a grappling thing and I loved it so much.

Yeah. And then uh then I got shipped over to WA and then from there I kind of got my apprenticeship. And how old were you when you went from Penrith over here? I would have been 17.

Yep. I just had uh Action Jackson on two weeks ago. We actually I think we talked about you Glenmore Park. Yeah, that's what made me think of it.

The roof boy. Hey Jax. Um it was good. We left here.

We had a coffee for an hour. He's I I've always obviously known of him and stuff. Heap of circles from Lee to M. Everyone knows everyone.

But I never actually spent that much time with him. It was really cool. And that's what made me think of it, you know, the Sydney. And he went back there for a bit, hang out with his dad, and then he come back and he really got serious.

Yeah. So, sorry. Yeah. 17 Perth.

There's only not much else to do there. You see that? Getting punch up all the time or get in trouble or get in trouble. Definitely build you different over there.

Yep. Yep. Um, so, so 0 to 17 you were over there. You grew up in Penrith and then uh you come over here and got apprenticeship.

What was your apprenticeship? Plumber. I'm a plumber. Oh, you're a plumber?

Are you prick of a trade? That one isn't it? thieves on it. It's hard to insure actually.

Plum plum it like it's not hard but it's like it's one of the ones they don't like. Yeah. You get you get a $5 part four stories up and it floods everything. That's why they don't like it.

Liability. Where'd you start that mate? The plumbing. Uh I actually started in Geraldton.

Oh, did you? I lived in Geraldton for a couple of years, give or take, and then got an apprenticeship there. Had a falling out with the uh owner of that. Yep.

um little oneman band situation and then pretty much a big company called Cooper and Jones which is in Perth. They were going to do like the hotel something up there and then that job fell through for him and they pretty much said to me hey if you still want your apprenticeship you can stay where you are and try and find somebody else or you can come to Perth and I was like get me the out of you to go from Sydney to Geraldton was definitely a very very big adjustment. It was difficult and also came from like some Yeah. Most high school I went to an all boy school.

So like to go from to go from that to a co-ed school was difficult. Was really what was the biggest challenge? It is I'm under no illusion of how much people more so boys just honestly around just to impress the girls. Yeah, it was very apparent to me just within a couple of days of being there.

I was like this is I didn't finish but I got suspended like a couple of days in the school but um here we are. What what for? Uh, or did you let it out of bag? No, obviously it's going to involve violence.

So, I got a little bit in a little bit of a scuff at school. Nice way to put it. Yeah. And just never went back.

So, and then Yeah. But hey, it was part of your uh occupation later. Play stupid games prizes and he won stupid prizes. So, yeah.

Okay, cool. That was uh that was put very nicely. So, yeah. So, yeah.

Gero to Perth. So, 17. How long were you in Gero? Couple of years.

So couple in a bit. Yep. So you might have been 19 when you got to Perth. 20.

I was 18 when I got to Perth. So I was a little bit I probably just under 17 when I moved there. Yeah. I was 18 when I 18 when I moved to Perth.

Yep. And then um continued on with my apprenticeship. How long that end up taking you with a couple of little jumps? Did it you still do it less than four years or you do it in the four?

I still in four years. In the four. Yeah. Good.

Yeah. My I don't know if I should say this. Might get in trouble. They sign me off early because I uh I'd progressed quite well in competing and fighting and stuff and I had the opportunity to kind of go over to Europe and then fight in Thailand and stuff.

So, uh instead of holding me back a little bit, they just kind of sign me off early and I just got to go and chase me thing and do that there. And I had a great relationship with them that when I would come back sporadically or even when I was here and I was looking for work, they always they always How good is that? Always always gave me work. never ever like even if they didn't really need me, they put me on anyway.

So I I just want to bring I'll butt in here and then you'll get used to it. Something that just highlighted big time is the school system, right? Like here you are scuff whatever you want to call it suspended right out but you go and you work for a big company and they sign you off early so you obviously work well that you know what I mean? It might have been to meet something but a lot of a lot of apprenticeships short uh finish short these days.

That's why I asked you. And um but you know, if you do well, you've done well, you come back and they make try and make you get get work. Like that's opposite opposite, right? Hard work are good.

Like not everyone's good at the whole school thing. And that Oh, it's their own. I just Yeah. It just wasn't for me.

And that's right. That's the point. So I don't think you should ever look at more so now cuz I've got my own kids, you know? I just like I'm honestly just man, whatever you want to do, I'll back it.

Let's rock and roll. How good is that? You don't have to. There's no white picking off fence.

It's not what you want. You don't want to go to school? I mean, I'm not still still got education, but like you don't want to go to uni and do this or do that. AI is going to have your job anyway.

Yeah. Yeah, that's right. So, well, their job's probably not even created yet. That's what I always say about my kids.

Like, cuz it's evolution, right? Wait and see. Yep. Horse cart, tractor, all that.

Like and like I just think AI we've got no choice and I'm pretty indepth with it but to a certain degree compared to others but I I always say I don't think our kids jobs are created yet for sure and their learning's different. I just what do you know what it's like the scares me to be honest. Yeah it doesn't it well there's no shovel anymore or you know there's none of this old hard yaka stuff. I can't see an AI coming to play with people's anytime soon.

That's true man. I think I'll be in with a job for a while. You'll be all right. Do you ever do any plumbing now?

Still a fair bit now. Oh, do you? Yeah, I've been doing a little bit more as of late. I've got three kids now.

So, my pull out game needs to be quicker, obviously. So, the only plumbing I see you do is putting finger up bums on a couple of couple instas. Oh, chi. He loves a finger at the bum.

Oh, mate. I You make me laugh. I could have the worst day and I I can see you there and I'll be like, "Yep, this is going to be funny." Yeah. Anyway, anything to do with fingers in the bum's always funny, is it?

Always funny. always give a smile. Um, so yeah, back to Perth, finished apprenticeship. What?

Go back to the fighting bit. Where where did Joe gel in Perth for you? Like where did you train and I went to a few different gyms and uh it was only because I was playing footy up in Geraldton and they paying me like my fuel and stuff to go up there and keep playing for the team. But then like we got pretty early into the season and I got suspended for like half the season for getting into punchup with Malaw Football Club.

So then I was like, well, I don't know what am I going to do now. So then I was like looking for places to train and I went to a few different places and then I walked into Mach1. Yep. And then I just I just got a nice reception from them like soon as I walked in.

Yep. Hey champ, how you going? Like made me feel quite warm and fuzzy and nothing was really ever uh I don't know. Nothing nothing was really difficult.

Oh, can I do? Yeah, man. Come in. Try this.

Try. It was pretty laidback, pretty very inviting. So when would that have been? I don't know, man.

I get punched in the face. You want to ask me about Yeah, this is what this is about. What? Roughly 20.

No, I walked in at 18. Oh, at 18 when you come back. Oh, so you done it straight away when you come back? Yeah.

Yeah. Oh, good. 18 pushing 19 and I I don't know him but trained with Hab for 3 months and then I had my first MMA fight after 3 months. Yeah.

was Belmont Oasis Centre and that was against Romel Luistro, who has got Quillan Salkilld and all them guys. He's I mean he's an amazing coach. He's really really good coach. Yeah.

The time and effort that he puts into his guys. You can see that. Yeah, man. I really really respect and appreciate where he's gone to progress those guys along.

Especially like Cody Haddon and stuff like that. All those guys are doing really well. So I wish all them nothing but the best. That's really cool, man.

Cuz like that obviously that there was what 18 years ago roughly um that you you fought him and um just to see now both your journeys and then you got this utmost respect for him. He's got all these great fighters like it's really cool. I feel like too many people get hung up on hating people having hate with like yeah you are fighting each other but yeah I don't know man even talking to Jackson the other day man he's like he spoke about like even even when he didn't think he such a nice guy as well unbelievable and he's like I think I should have won that one but I'm actually still really good mates I think it was Paul over in Sydney Pauling Fleming and he goes man I bring it up I said you just got banner over it he goes I thought I should have but it didn't change the relationship and respect he's like he's like we're good mates and like we talk and like that. It's just so good to see.

Wow. Why not? Life's too short to be hanging on to like that. Once you punch someone in the face a few times, that changes everything.

You know what I mean? So, it's definitely more enjoyable. He he did he did say something to me. I don't know your thoughts.

He said just probably how much there's still a little bit of corruptness in the game. What do you mean a little bit? Okay. I was trying to be really polite, but he when he's come out, he talks about it a bit.

Um doesn't say anything really bad. He just said uh it was a big shock I think and understanding now. Yeah. Politics.

Politics in anything you do in life. It doesn't matter what we're talking we want to talk about. It doesn't matter what avenue want to go down here. Yeah.

When there's humans involved when there's money involved and there's going to be corruption. So I mean I've been on the long end and the short end of the stick. So what are you going to do? Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it is. Unless you have a fair bit of money behind you and a lot of backing, you're generally always going to be on the short end of the stick.

So, Mhm. So, what why what makes you still fight now? I went through a stage where I was like couldn't be bothered whatsoever and I had a fair bit of time off and I had a few kids as well, so I was just on the pump pretty there. And then I don't know I I I'll tell you when it was.

I went and helped a few guys that were fighting on the next Eternal card come back a few years ago and I was pretty severely out of shape. Like I was I hadn't done any training and nothing really and they were short on some bodies. So I was like I'll just jump in. Like I was thinking myself I might be able to give you a few minutes here and there like helping like slide into these kind of you know wherever they need me.

And I went in, I towed him up, you know, and I was just like, man, I should have another have another crack. Another crack. Let's get in there. Why not?

So that's pretty much the only reason why I did it. Yeah. Went in there. And you jump back on Eternal, didn't you?

I think I might have watched you on Eternal. Yeah, I watched a few of your fights. Um, yeah, good. Yeah.

Few more MMA fights. No matter what, we always get a laugh when you come in. It's good. 100%.

Bit of banter and all be doom and gloom, you know. So, um, so how old are the three kids, man? Like I'm going to try and piece them into the My daughter's seven. Yep.

My son is three and then my other son is one. Yeah. Nice. Any more coming?

No way. I'm going to ch my dick off. How and uh I suppose take your hat off to to yourself definitely. And um but to your partner, right?

Yeah. It's definitely I mean everything has its challenges. Everything's difficult but I don't know running a business and trying to do three kids and all the and train and fight as well. I mean something has to give here.

So I have to give credit to my wife in the sense of when I am pretty heavily training or trying to chase a guy well she has to pick up a fair bit of the slack with the kids and stuff. So I mean the business still suffers as well because it takes me away but it also helps the business a little bit because I'm competing so it's still correlated. Oh yeah, I get you. There's that double-edged sword for the biggest thing that would take to hit would be probably my family to be fair.

Yeah. Takes me away a fair bit. And I just don't have as much time nor patience. Yeah.

With the kids cuz you're so focused on Yeah. Like I'm tired. I'm still I just don't grumpy. Yeah.

Oh yeah. And especially if I'm cutting weight, I'm not the nicest person to be around, you know? I don't think anyone probably being angry is not ideal. So anyway, um but yeah, she definitely picks up the fort bit more in that regard, which is nice.

So supportive. How long you guys been together? Oh Or shouldn't I ask that question? No.

Uh you're coming on 12 13 years. Oh yeah. Nice. Yeah.

Oh yeah. it. 23. I was about 25.

25ish. There's a bit of a gray area there, you know. 25 26ish give or take. Yep.

Yep. Yep. Yeah. So, she did she work in the gym?

She did. Yeah, she did, didn't she? I think I seen her on and off. Yeah, I was working there for a while until we had like our third and then it was just um we're still trying to do it with the third.

But it was just like we just hate each other too much. It's not Yeah. like trying to work together, live together, raise kids together, and then there's no makeup time. Too many Yeah.

There's too many there's too many juggling balls there of one relationship. So, it's probably easier it was better for her to kind of step away from the business a little bit and just kind of focus on the kids, which is like a bit of a sad thing in this day and age. I believe is, you know, it's I feel like it's a it's a privilege privilege for a parent to be able to stay home and and look after their kids, you know, cuz unfortunately you need two parents at at work now trying to, you know, I was actually talking about that two days ago like I was talking about to this chick that she's um home with kids at the moment and and I said it is a privilege like a lot of people near the double income, you know, um with kids, not no kids. So, um it's a bit of a bit of a struggle, but if you can do it, very very lucky.

Like we're lucky. Uh when I was with Michelle and we had the kids, I think it was always great. Like, yeah, I might have done over hours, but I loved it anyway. It was probably my get away a bit detriment, too.

But, um Mish being able to stay with the kids like that that time with the mom and the kids. Who's going to love your kids to look after their kids like you do? You do. And like look at childheads and that these days it's a numbers game and it's expensive and hard work.

Well, like so many well even just from the ladies class I thought a second ago, you know, like there's so many of those ladies there that are kind of on Matt leave or ration and and they I can tell most of them they don't want to go back to work like they want to not not that they feel like they need to be lazy or anything. Just tell that it's like I want to stay with my children like I want to be here with my children. So I I empathize in that regard just I just not Yeah. I don't know.

And I used to love I used to love like like people would go, "Oh, is your wife work?" All that kind of stuff. And there was everyone's got different dynamics. I love that my wife can go and be there early ready to pick the kids up. You're not rushing, you know, drop like all that.

And then, you know, you slip in when you can. Um, but that they are the rock when it comes to that piece. You don't realize, especially when you got business, like you train, you you know, they they they hold that bit with with not even not even talking about it. It just naturally happens, right?

And I think sometimes I probably reflected on it more when I when we split. It's like how much like from having the kids to, you know, just how much they are that rock. I used to tell Mish that like let me do this bit, I'll leave you do that bit cuz they're unbelievable at it like naturally. You know what I mean?

No, it's just I'm not I'm not trying to sound like a dick, but like they're designed to do it. Like they have that nurturing aspect, you know, like and I feel like the kids need that. Y and you don't know who's like I think it's I honestly think it's just so sad that you drop your children off at 7 a.m. in the morning.

You don't pick them up until 5. You literally have somebody else raising your children and sad. Like I think that's sad. Yeah.

Sorry. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's just sad.

I And sad as in like it's unfortunate that some people have got to do it like feel sorry for you. Yeah. Yeah. It's like um I'm not sorry.

I just But it's a bonus when you can It's nice. It's a privilege to do that and I'm super happy for you. And if not, people's just going to keep grinding and keep doing what they got to do. But like, I don't know.

It's definitely Yeah. Not the way that I And do do you know do you know the little bit that just resonated with me, right? Like obviously us growing up. I'm 43, so I'm older than you.

Sometimes there's people older than me in your prime. Yeah. I I love it actually. 40s.

Um, is the whole love piece and growing up and like you're a bit of a hard ass. You grew up in Penrith. You come here, you've always fought obviously look at, you know, school and all that. And I mean that that that's the that's the truth in it.

And I probably grew up a little bit like that. But what we learn I think and this is just watching you and knowing you is that you do show show that opposite side a lot more than probably say our parents did. I do as well that love side and all that. But that's what the kids get from the mom if they get to stay home.

That whole love piece and understanding and emote like the chat like communication now with my kids. I know what I'm like. I try and talk about everything whether that I'm kicking their ass whether it's like well done or you should be proud of yourself like change the whole dynamics and the seen and not heard you know you're a kid do as you told like probably brings back some I'm guessing days it's just different man it's no different to this whole AI conversation before you don't like things are I just feel like things are constantly changing and evolving just in general life for this day and age you know I feel like BS are probably doing a hell of a lot more just hands-on stuff with the kids than what they did, I don't know, 20 years ago, 30 years ago, you know, I feel like dads are stepping up a lot more in that regard, you know, instead of just you tell the kids and we're going to the pub or, you know, whatever. Y that's a generic.

It's Yeah, it's a stereotype, right? I reckon we're in the best generation, though. I love being I think I said it in maybe in Jerry's podcast. I think we're in a really lucky generation like me and you.

I'm I can be really old school. I love the traditional stuff, but I also love the modern and being that shift probably in my family or the or the generation. I I love the like since I split I've done held a mirror up and learn a lot, right? Like self, you know, development like we all do and and I no doubt you have cuz you know I can just tell by the way you you act and you're with your kids and you're joking and all that.

Like you wouldn't get our parents getting on Instagram. No, but different times I suppose. Different times, right? But that's what I mean by we're lucky.

But if we follow the sheep, we probably wouldn't do it. But people like me and you don't mind either getting laughed at getting out there. But do you know like even doing this how much people message me, you get the odd ones like, "What are you doing?" I get more positive than anything to do with the kids. You know, I put heaps up about the kids, right?

And that's probably a bit of a me thing because when I first split, it really kick my ass. So now it's like I try and have the best quality time with them. But like you're pretty similar. Like you don't mind putting stuff up, being funny or family or like even sharing now, you know?

Like and men wouldn't do that before. Even guy to guy like talk about you got to bottle those got to bottle those emotions up. Push those suppress those push them down. Push those way down.

We don't talk about that Tears. What are they? Oh, half a glass of concrete. They're rubbish.

No. Yeah. I don't know. And it's good seeing it from guys like you that obviously, you know, you're sharing, you're going through, you you know, stereotype you're a fighter, so everyone thinks, you know, that big tough guy, but you go meet and no doubt you are, but you go meet fighters and all that.

They're probably the most disciplined people and the most evolving and learning. Like look at Jackson. Yeah. I'm like he's a he is a poster child of what we're talking about, right?

And he's been through we taught more non-boxing probably than we did and he shared heaps. It was really cool and very similar, you know, like I feel like most fighters are half decent people. It's just Yep. the facade that they maybe carry or even like just the aura that they have may seem like they're a dick, but honestly, most there are a lot of dicks out there wrong, but most are pretty good.

Yeah. And usually it's like ego and all that stuff, but take that away. You need to have ego to do it. Yeah.

Confidence, ego. There's a fine line. You need to have you got to have some form of that to even try and be half decent at you got to like it's not well it's a backing yourself as well right like you in that game like I I used to say when I learned Eternal and got to know Ben and Cam and I remember the tan club and then I actually helped him out a fair bit in the background and went to HBF right cuz they they turned into an entertainment mall you know and I remember having the chat with Ben after walking around Sticky Falls a tan club it's chockers and then I'm like Ben you got to get out of here, man. Like, he's like, "We could never do it." And and then they turn into an entertainment.

The next thing is getting people there, but they're like, "Oh, that's fighting and beat each other up." I used to always say to people, the worst people of the crowd, the fighters, they want to do it. They go in there. They're probably most disciplined, most calmst and nicest people. It's like the mates, you know, go Cody or any of their groups out there.

Other randoms and arguments rubbish. It's usually the crowd. Um the the fighting uh like combat sports um is really disciplined really like all around. Well, you got to be I suppose you could like Yeah.

I went to the bare knuckle with a few lads in Townsville the other month. Rough now but nothing happened outside I don't think. It was really good because no one wants it. So Townsville had it.

They took it on. Mate, Queensland is the wild wild west. Yeah, especially up there. Dude, they got no I don't I don't even think they have a commission there.

Like there's don't they? Dude, if you want anything that's remotely maybe a little bit left field risque, you go to Queensland. Like they will they will do anything there. They It's just a wild wild west.

They don't give a They'll do anything there. WA is probably the strictest, I reckon. Melbourne is pretty bad. Well, it took a bit to get the UFC here, didn't it?

Yeah. Like W's probably the most stringent with a lot of things, but Melbourne's okay. They're probably in the middle. Yeah, but uh Queensland, you can do whatever you want there.

You spent much time in Melbourne? Yeah, four there quite a fair bit. Yep. Trained there a fair bit.

So, so 17 and under. What was it like growing up? Penrith parents together. How many siblings you got?

I got Give us a little I've got four siblings. So, my mother had me. Were you either? My mother had me quite young.

Mom pregnant at 18 had me young and then my biological father was never in the equation. Yep. So he was never in the equation, left and whatever else. And then uh she met my stepdad and then essentially had my next sister who's seven years younger than me.

And then we pretty pretty kind of grew up together in some regard. I was pretty much out of home by the time she such a similar story. Yeah. And then kind of out of home before she even kind of started high school.

Y and then my mom had like a midlife crisis and instead of buying a red Ferrari, she had three more kids. So my next sibling after that is my brother. He's 22 and my brother's 21 and then my sister's 17. Oh wow.

Yeah. So she's in your 12. Shim 12 this is year I think. Yeah.

So no Ferrari. Definitely know a Ferrari. You probably paid enough to get a Ferrari. But uh can I ask and you don't have to touch on if you don't want.

Are you close with all your siblings? Are you do you just get along? Do you not? There's a few years.

No. It's hard to I probably speak to my brother the most as of late. Yeah. Only cuz he lives here now.

Oh, does he? He lives here. When did he come? Uh he's gone to uni for a few years here and then he's got like a free membership in the gym.

So, he just kind of comes in and does bicep. Thanks, bro. Then he leaves. I'm like, you can do some squats.

Look at those legs, man. Chicken legs. I got toothpick sticking those. Anyway, uh probably speak to him, but uh yeah, probably mainly only So, yeah, probably only him really.

I've had a few miscommunication situations with the other ones. So, probably mainly only him. And then the other ones, I mean, I'm so much older than them. I just like it's hard to when they get older probably my maybe.

Yeah. Like, I'm just at a totally different stage of life. One's, you know, my other one's just started. He's doing a plumbing apprenticeship as well.

So, he's like few years into that. The other one's still at high school. I'm three kids deep, dude. Like I'm at a totally different life position than what they are.

So, you know, Yeah. What am I going to do? Yep. A little bit more effort probably wouldn't hurt, but Yep.

Don't know if I want to do that. Yeah. So, what about your mom? Do you talk to your mom?

Not really. I I don't talk to mine for a few years either, but love it a bit. Uh she's a beautiful woman, but certain reasons. Just old school mentality.

I wish probably pull her head out of for a bit. Um it's really hard to deal with especially when you're like positive and just want to continually grow like or evolve. And then I'm over here obviously she moved over here for years. One of my sisters did.

Um we'll rekindle and I I've sent actually sent a mother's day and birthday messages longer than normal just to try and like it's up to you kind of thing. Um yeah it's it's hard in it. The family dynamics thing's hard. I'm the same as you.

dad was out of the picture. stepdad sister first sister was 5 years difference like very very similar to you and I live with her so I'm really close with her and I got two other sisters um and that dynamics is off a bit as well but I mean everyone's situation's obviously slightly different in in some respects but definitely you have to say this a dick um so whatever your parent like for you as a parent or for me as a parent you don't wake up every day or I don't wake up every day thinking how can I my kids up how can I how can I give my children issues later or how can I give them trauma or whatever in this situation you only know what you know you only know and you only work with the tools that you have the time and for that I can't be upset or be or have animosity for her as a teenage single parent for the tools that she had like that I can't fault her for whatsoever it's the other things progressing on after that that things have moved on and it's probably more so of a reflection that I probably need to do some more growth for myself in the concept of she's not going to change and I need to accept that and if I can't accept that then I need to kind of really remove myself and that's what I've kind of done a little bit as of the last few few years is I just uh I this position I'm at in my life I just can't accept that that's how she is. And it's a bit of a shame because it's my mom, dude. Yep.

You know, like I I literally owe everything to this woman. It's hard. But I need to accept that how this is how she is. This is how she conducts herself and this is the way that she emotionally and mentally is able to move her way through life.

I need to just accept that that's how she is or not. And at the moment, at the moment, I'm not. So, which isn't the right. I feel like it's not the right mentality cuz it's not about me anymore cuz like I look at my kids well my even my daughter like she this has happened probably two years ago and my daughter was like she sees nan and pop as my wife's pop she sees them all the time and they're w so they're like in a real what nationality uh she's half Croatian half German me and you have more synergies than I realize let me comment on that what I learn about the female thing and the mom and all the way to the daughter.

Women are Did you just say that? Continue. We're not going to start these jokes, are we? Um, so I'll go back to everything you just said is like mirror of what I worked on the last two years.

I haven't spoken to mom for probably 3 years. And it's the victim mentality. I'm just going to say that. And she's old school and I still talk to my sister now.

And we actually get more I actually feel sorry for her, right? I don't want to talk about too much. But what I had to do instead of being blank is accept that she's the way she is. And I've just done that.

You know, when I said I sent messages recently, Mother's Day and birthday. Well, last two years I haven't. I've just like ignored it. I tried to reach out once, but it was a bit I was a bit halfass as well, right?

Because I probably wasn't ready. But you've got to be ready. Also, it's not to be hard on yourself. It's like cuz you go through this window.

I've learned a lot from not talking to her. Then, mate, you you hit gives me chills what you said. You would not believe whether it's dating now, my ex-wife, my daughter. The moment I let go and send my mom a message and I in my head I got part I was I was at your point only four months ago for two three years I I turned around I'm like and I talked to Nat my EA heaps about this cuz she knows everything.

I'm like it. I let go. I said mom you're amazing. Happy Mother's Day.

I said I wouldn't be here without you. Like a proper message not just a happy birthday. Happy Mother's Day. Right.

And I wrote her two long messages and I'm really close with her my nan. I just went and stayed with her the other week in how long country Victoria and we talk about this but my mom only knows what she knows and there's a couple of points here and I talked to my nan about this now right because obviously when my nan had my mom like my nan said they meant she was meant to give her up in the hospital in Melbourne right she only told me this weeks ago so I learned I've gone digging right and then I've kind of I'm like mom happy birthday all that you're amazing person genuinely when the moment I done that it shifts my whole in here with the females in my world now go back two years I went and done a psychedelic the cactus just out here just when I 6 months after splitting I was still a roller coaster then I still didn't know where I was at I was trying to hold a mirror up 16 hours man 24 hours but 16 hours in it in the hole the I've done it twice but the first one half of it four big knots I pushed out I laid down I done it on my own not in a group I paid extra I spent the whole time by myself I knocked the roof off the house someone guiding you then yeah yeah still he mate I reckon two of the big knots were to do with females in my world going back my aunties, my grandmothers, one just died in November. They're both in the hospital at the same time. The one I talked about, she come out.

I didn't think she was. The one I thought was coming out didn't. I just went and checked the grave out the other day. Now that they were hard workers, Aussie, you know, all that stuff.

And I sat there like, this is, you know, in the moment. Yeah. In the hole. One of the knots I let out was letting go and understanding my female journey all the way to my my stepmom, like my other sister's mom that's now passed 10 years ago from a tumor to my mom.

Without going into too much, the other point I want to make is about parents only know what they know. Now, someone asked me, I talked a bit about this yesterday with someone. I moved out of home when I was 15, violence, and a few other things. I I don't want to go in because I am doing my story on the journey website.

I'm going to do that, but I'm struggling with it because you don't want to say anything bad. But the the point is parents only know what they know. And when you start to understand that when you get older and more mature, you can forgive. You don't have to condone.

You don't have to accept. Now that's what I learned and but you can forgive. Now I moved out of home. I end up clashing with my stepdad right when I was 15.

Probably my best mate give me tears. My best mate now is him. Boom. And I forgave you.

Trust me. I was never going to forgive a lot of stuff. He was a hard ass. But he brought me up since I was 16 months old and he put food on the table.

And now me and him speak about his upbringing. Right. Yeah. And it just changes my whole game even more.

I'm pretty self-reflective. Like I've learned a lot last couple of years. Yeah. Well, you don't know what he's done to get to there and then we talk now.

Yeah. You know, so that's we talk now. He he can't know anymore. So, we talk about trauma and all that, which you know, I follow Gabor Mate and listen to Mel Robbins, all the rest of them, right?

I do that heaps. Yeah. And I try and like just get nuggets all the time, every day, right? To be a better dad, a better husband or partner or whatever.

There's a whole trauma thing and they say that traumas that you couldn't speak up, not the actual event, right? Mhm. Now, that's what we're all taught at them. Our parents definitely, right?

You go back and you learn um what your parents went through or how come they only know what they know and that you just all of a sudden have this appreciation, but you can call it trauma and that, but it's like I call it survival generation back then, right? We're not in that now. We're inconvenience now or whatever the you want to call it. We got a wicked life now, right?

Like our kids and we can complain about taxes and all the We got a wicked life. We're not in survival mode. you know, you nearly go by and do whatever you want, no matter who you are, right? You're not just putting baked beans on the table.

I I think we were meant to have this journey and trauma. I wouldn't be sitting here if I didn't go through what I went through as a kid without going into that right? Yeah. And it's kind of like, you know, what you were saying before about your mom.

I've learned now to probably forgive and let go of heaps. And going back to the female piece, I've done that probably with my ex-wife as well, one of my sisters and my mom. And it changes the game. You know where I felt the impact change?

The relationship with my daughter, which I've had to re not rebuild cuz I got a wicked one, but it's different since moving out of the house. I know that was a bit of a loop. Yeah. But the letting go of that stuff and sitting in it like like you said, I'm not ready.

It let weight off my shoulders, man. And it started starts with my mom and now it's up to her to come back. I hope that made sense. Yeah.

It's like I'm obviously like sitt sitting and processing for myself. Yeah, of course. So, it's uh they're never going to change. But can we part of their life?

Can the kids because we're only holding up like you know you said about your daughter that's why she's seven, right? That's what I was trying to say earlier. just you know she sees n pop as them you know and she doesn't couldn't understand the concept you know a couple years ago of you trying to say you have another nan you know you have a mom you have a mom dad you know yeah I have mom and show like an old picture of her like tiny and being wow you got you have what and then trying to piece it together for her you know and I don't know your scenario like obviously it's all everyone's is different but when you said it before that I'm not ready but hopefully one day I can be or you know whatever it is like Cuz in the end, take all the aside. You're still the kid.

Unconditional love up and down, both ways. They're still your mom. Like you said, she's still my mom. And I think that's probably the bit that hit you before.

Like that's the bit that always hit you. It's like still your dad, still your mom. Even not your biological dad, they still brought you up. Like even whether it was hard or not hard like half my traits are like Yeah.

Even even that situation in itself, you know, for him to step in and and fill the void that was being was missing or, you know, coming in and taking in a single mother and then wanting to grow a family from there, you know, that that I mean, I know it makes it probably a little bit easier when there isn't a father in the in the scene, you know? It makes it a little bit easier when it's just a single mother cuz sometimes you can have like crazy toxic exhusband or ex partner or whatever, you know? So makes it probably a little bit easier. He can kind of slide into that.

Do you talk Do you talk to him? No, not at all. So no one uh he's he's a good dude. He's he's a he's a good guy.

Yeah, I got Yeah, that's cool. Nothing bad to say about anybody. It's just life has thrown a few curve balls and people haven't called them. I I think that's probably the point I was probably getting at before is no one knows.

There's no rule book. There's no right or like you said before, we don't wake up in the morning like my parents, I can guarantee they didn't. Deep down, they're all good people. They've just had their own.

They don't know how to handle it. Working with the tools. Working with the tools they have, right? And that's why go back to us.

We're lucky, man. I hope so. Well, I think we are. I think, you know, from even from the whole socials and just the way we conduct business or being a parent now, it's like, oh, totally different.

Totally different, man. It'll be different again. Imagine when our kids have kids. when I'm old and decrepit, you know, they're no.

So, so what's um So, how long just just quickly on that before we shift, how long was your stepdad in your world? From when I was like five, six. Yeah. Young young.

Yeah. So, they're big big impact there. Yeah. Yeah.

That's cool. I I reckon you take you later on in life, you learn a lot about that like cuz they're not your biological, right? But there some like you said, there's someone that stepped in. No, he stepped in very gentle man.

Is he? Yep. Very soft, gentle man. Y.

So I So you probably needed a bit of that. You did probably probably need a little bit more than that. Now I'm trying to be like that with my kids. It's just hard.

What makes you try and be like that with your kids now? Because you don't want to uh Yeah. Like you think this is just my perspective like how whatever things that happen as for me whatever being discip disciplined as a child how things would progress on moving forward. I feel sometimes I go, "Oh, cool.

I I can resonate with that. I would like to maybe replicate that and do that with my children." But then other things I go, "Yeah, no, that probably wasn't the best." That me up a little bit. I'm probably going to want to do that to my kids. You know, like I said, you're always trying to trial and error.

my kids up. But uh I don't know this I'm not and I don't get it right either. And like if you can be on the same page with your partner then it's always a good thing. You know if if you're not on the same page with a lot of things in your butting heads on how one you should discipline or two how you should drive this thing moving forward makes it definitely a lot more difficult.

My wife is without a doubt the like the calmer y lighter one of the situation. So she definitely combats a lot of the other the the opposite's good though. Me and Michelle were the same. And I reckon that's where we really won.

Like especially when we first got together and then had the kids. That's where we we were yin and yang. Like cuz she came from creation. I moved out of home and she's still at home at 27.

Like it was like and I I was a lucky man for that. It was like it was a wicked combo for that same reason, right? She was a How do you find handsome strong man? I think that she's that introvert quiet like really calm like with the kids.

But I also don't think that's should be 100% either because they need both. You need build resilience. You need to have a crack, you know, risk licking every now and then. Yeah.

I was going to ask you, um, do your kids get in the gym a lot? No. No, not at all. I not Whatever they want to do, they want to do.

My only thing is like it's non-negotiable. They will like as long as they can throw a sharp one too and ch someone unconscious, I'm okay. Yeah. I'm not going to be able to wipe your ass forever.

And I want my kids to be able I think maybe not so much like females but like definitely for blo I want my boys to be able to walk into a room and if gets pear-shaped then they have confidence so they can walk out of there unscathed you know that's how I want I don't want them to ever go looking for trouble or be a dead like they used to be. I would like them just to be able to have self-control and if it comes to it let them go if they need to. Y just Yeah. Look after himself.

Look after him. Simple as that. Don't fight. Do something else.

Fighting's stupid. Go go go go play golf or something. Well, in in the mornings, I used to every day say to the kids, have fun, be kind. You know, when we were growing up was like what'd you learn?

Go learn, you know, all that. I always say have fun, be kind. But the negative, why not? I talk to them about is like don't bully.

I'll kick your like that whole picking on people, you know? And I kind of drum that in. Obviously, first off, have fun. Be kind was always, but when that come up or could come up, I'd always talk about that because I wanted that to be entrenched because, you know, they could get in the wrong circles where because schools are pretty harsh or social.

You are who you hang around. Sorry. You are who you hang around. If you hang around, should be a dead So, and and sometimes there's a lot of bad luck and good luck in timing and all that as well, right?

So, I've just always said you never bully whether it's online or at school or like help everyone, you know, be kind, have fun. No m the online bullying is just like honestly putrid to see. What's your thoughts on the whole tech tech thing? I a lot of parents like I don't want them on tech and all that stuff.

I'm like I'd rather ed I'm a techie guy so I can't really hold it back and they learn more than I teach them but it's like it's the trust thing, right? It's like educate them on the balance. I'm just going to try and honestly I'm probably a little bit too vanilla in that regard. None of my kids have any devices.

They don't. Yeah, there's no right and wrong. No. And that's right for me.

I just don't want Yeah. No devices. I don't have an They don't have an iPad. They don't have occasional once in a blue moon if we're out eating dinner or doing something may pass them my phone and put on bloody something on there and they'll watch it.

But like 99% of the time they don't have anything. And that's how I want to try and run that as long as I possibly can. Have them not have a phone for as long as they possibly can. Yeah, they're definitely a good tool, but they use it, not have it use you.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I I agree with you and I sometimes wish I did that.

Um but I've always kind of, you know, we sit on our phones. I lived on mine with business while I was at that, you know, with the wife and kids. So now at this age though, it's all about the balance. And even now, I'm probably too soft on it, right?

I got to pull them up. It all starts with us, not the kids or not the online. It's us. So what you're doing is amazing, I reckon, cuz it's hard some days.

Yeah. I just think playing I'm playing the long game, not the short game. It's all I got to keep thinking. And my wife is saying we're in the same boat.

We're just refuse to try and really try and push that as far down the road as we possibly can. It'll get to a stage where we can't really fight anymore. But for now, I'm like, they're tiny. Does your seven-year-old ask about it at all?

No. No, cuz you haven't brought it in. So, you know, that's the best. Don't don't even get it.

Like I'm probably going to sound like a hell like weasel right now, but like for I'd say for the first like four to 5 years, like my daughter thought that like dessert was blueberries cuz we just didn't really give her like, you know, ice cream or other foods. But now, no, she's a fiend for her now. But like, daddy, can I have some dessert? Yeah, sure.

And she'd have like frozen blueberries or whatever. She still has frozen blueberries now, but you don't know. You don't know what you don't know. So, I mean, like I said, you can only push that envelope for as long as you possibly can.

Yeah. See how we go. Yeah. Yeah.

Is she daddy's girl? No, it depends. Depends on the day. Depends on the day.

She definitely loves his mom. Don't know. What about the other two? Uh, it's hard.

The one-year-old, he's just like not I don't know. He's starting to come into his own right now. He's like good. Middle one, he's a dick.

Yep. He's a dick. Such a dick. Is he more like dad then?

Oh, the murder is like just middle child. He's just a dick. But I love him. Love you, Lenny.

It's a good boy. My daughter and I probably clash a fair bit. I think it might be we might be a little bit similar in some regards. Probably clash with her the most.

Really? Yeah. Clash with her the most. Question for you.

No wrong right or wrong. Like when you do clash with her cuz she's seven and I probably learn at 5, six to change the way I do things with my boy actually. He probably taught me heaps at that point. Yeah.

Like when he was getting angry and all that stuff or we'd have an argument and it still happens now and then, but I just approach it different. But if you have a little tiff with your daughter, then if you clash, probably cuz you're alike. That's usually what happens. What do you do after or before or when you see it coming?

And I'm This is a curious question. My my first initial response just through how I am is obviously the louder I get, the more I'm heard, which isn't the case. Y which actually works the opposite. So, I mean, the biggest thing that I probably found I don't need to I don't need to be a male and I don't need to fix everything.

like I don't have to try and fix what the problem is. Maybe she just wants me just wants me to sit here and just hold space for her. And if I do that, then it's like way it's way easier moving forward from there. And that is still difficult cuz I feel like it's the response that most men have and that's to just try and fix everything.

Be the protector. Well, just let's be honest with logic means females not so much emotional. Yeah. So trying to uh calm down a wild horse, you know, you just hey, it's okay, you know, but even just Yeah, that's what I find.

If I can hide hold space for her and let her cook off and I don't really have to do anything from there, I get better success. But that's just through my daughter. Amazing. Amazing.

So that that's what I've learned as well, especially being single now and just kind of different relationship getting built. And she was very standoffish. She's come a long way now. I I always say I think if she got too close to me in the beginning, she probably thought she was cheating on her mom because it's so close.

That's the the look on her face I get, right? I had to have patience. I was always trying to go over the top a bit at the beginning like what do you need? What do you want dad?

And she'd shut me out more. But doing that and this is not even an argument. This is just in general like you know coming to stay with me and I learned heaps from it and it's that whole hold space and now it's the other way comes the other way now right and we got a different relationship. I had to learn that.

But I think I was a bit devo that that's what happened. But when I embraced it and all the other stuff we talked about before and then just let things be game changing. It'll evolve again. Yeah.

She's only what she 13 two weeks. It'll evolve seventh of August. No doubt when she's 16 17. Yep.

She'll probably hate you then. Do you know do you know I I learned the reason I asked you before is say you have an argument with them. I do it with a boy a bit and I'll go back and talk to them after after they sit in their right? and deal with their emotion, which we weren't taught to do, right?

Another learning over the years. Even the other night, she's doing invitation for her birthday. She goes, "What do you reckon, Dad?" And I had it in a group chat with my EA and I'm like, she got it and then I'm like, "Hey, Nat, can you go whack it in court or whatever and put some pink on it, you know?" And she wrote to me directly instead of in the group chat. And I love this.

She goes, "Hey, Dad. I know you're trying to help, but you know, I don't like AI much." She's 12. And she's like, and I just and she's told me this before, but I never took it in enough. And I go, "Darling, so sorry." And I said, "Totally understand." I said, "The invite you done.

These are the tips that I reckon. Did you go do it yourself?" She goes, "Yeah, I done it manually on Canva. Our manual days have been sticking glue." But she's like, "Manually done on Canva. No AI, right?" Which she probably doesn't think.

Well, might not. But anyway, it was so good. She text me direct. And I wrote back to her directly and I'm like, "I'm so proud of you for telling me that that's what you want." Yeah.

like instead of just going, "Yeah, whatever." I'm being submissive or push or I'm like, "Darling, speak up. I'm glad you told dad that." And you've done an amazing job, but I'd probably just change this and this, but it's up to you. And send it out. And she sent out 26 year7s that we got going if I can flip out in two sad days.

And uh yeah, it was good because I think being able to speak, so if I just shut her down or ignored it, you know, it'll just shut that door a little bit. And I've it's took me two years to progress back this way. It's the It's the 1% I reckon, man. It's them little after.

I definitely think I just want I just out of any of it, I just I just wanna my my biggest key for success as a parent is if I'm old and frail, my kids want to be around me still. That's that's I've done I've done I've done a good job. That's the only thing I'm hoping for. are doing a good enough job from now to whenever that when they're a little bit older and maybe they got their own kids and doing their thing that and they're hanging around you, they want to see dad or they still want to come hang out with me.

I've done a good job. I've done I've done my piece. So, I'm hoping that I can get to that, you know. So, that's amazing.

And I I spoke to this probably I know he's probably 70 something years old at Devons the other night and he he said he asked me about the kids and the separation. He's been separated years. His daughter's now 38 and they're close ass. He said, "But when I separated 14 years ago and when the daughter was younger, like from 12 to 15 to 17, it was like on and off." He go, "You know the best thing now?" He said, "I'm close as my daughter.

She runs my company and she's got a 15 and a 17year-old boy." Yeah. They're my world. Like cuz he's I don't know how old he is. He's on, but he's um he was wicked like Yeah.

And uh but that's his world. And the daughter runs a company. He's like I just got the boys like that whole grandkids thing. And I think that I said I don't relate, you know, all that stuff.

The whole relationship falls apart, especially at their age. And he's like, man, not many guys do that. It's always the attack, right? Or the bull or proving a point.

And usually it's about the parents, not the kids. And I'm like, and he's like, man, keep that the long game. Trust me, cuz it's going to change anyway. They'll go 15, they won't want to talk to you, then they want to.

So just, you know, let it be. And uh it was really good advice from him. And he goes, "Trust me, like my daughter's older now. We're close as she's 38 and remarried." And he had to step in cuz the ex the father.

It was just a really cool story to help me resonate on the journey I'm on, you know, and um that's all you want in it. You want him to be around you, talk to you. Want to be around dad. Dad hopefully is still cool.

He wants to be hang around. I don't think you could be uncool, dude. Hey, I hope I'm still jumping out of a plane at that age. So, I I did want to ask you about that.

Let's get on to some more more exciting stuff. I think thanks for that chat though and sharing that because it's really close to me also. Should we cry and have fun? No, no, no.

We don't have to. Well, you can if you want. The jumping out of plane thing. I didn't know you done it until probably 12 months ago.

I seen you doing it. Um do do you always go Jurien? Uh there's two places. There's Jurien Bay.

That's where I did my license. Then there's another place called Hillman Farm which is it's pretty much either go two hours south or 2 hours north pretty much. So Hillman Farm's right near Williams, the town of Williams. Yep.

Kind of turn right off Williams and then it's kind of down a few dirt tracks and it's there. So I've jumped the military the military do I think it's the oldest drop zone in the country actually. Is it? It's pretty much where all the military do their training.

Is it near Pinjarra? Not far from there. Yeah, clearly in a bit. I think I might have been there.

Darken. Is it okay? Well, I've done Jurien. I've done Broome, Jurien.

I didn't do Rottnest today. No, Jurien. I got mostly go to I've done four like tandem. Tandem, not sing.

But m I love it. I absolutely love it. So when I seen you do it, I'm like I've never hit you up about it. I'm like that's wicked.

Yeah. Um I don't know. Am I actually My wife bought it for a wedding present for our for our wedding gift. Yep.

Whatever it is. I got her nothing. Uh yeah. I had three kids.

Yeah. Yeah. So, I just uh it's part of my bucks party actually. How long how long ago did you start doing it?

When did you get married or next question? I think I just started I didn't do it straight away. So, I think I've been jumping for 3 years now. Mhm.

Three or so years, give or take. Yeah. Okay. It's not that long.

I thought watching you do it. I thought it must have been a bit longer than I'm just a gum. You just uh I've been putting a fair bit of time and effort into it. It's like I go when I can, but obviously with the three kids and business and stuff, it makes it a little bit difficult trying to go.

So, how often do you go? Like, when's the last time you went? 3 weeks ago. Oh, I did.

Yeah. Three weeks ago. Yeah. So, you're single now.

You're on your own. Yeah. Listen, when you're signing to do your course, your first jump is on your own. Is it?

There's no practice jumps. Oh, is that right? So, when you're ready to do that, so do you want me to tell you experience for me? So when I did my license up in Jurien, you do like a full day course.

So uh Hillman Farm is the same. So they it's called a so it's like that's the course you're going for. Pretty much do a full day of ground school just all the theory ins and outs and they run you through a few little practical things and then pretty much I went to sleep woke up the next day which was a Friday and then you do your first jump. Uh Hillman I think is a little bit different but during pretty I did a tandem jump with my tandem instructor for the he was my instructor for the day.

Yep. So, we did one tandem jump and he pretty much talks you through what's going on, blah blah blah. And then 45 minutes later, you do your first jump by yourself. So, you jump out of the plane, two instructors hold on to you when you leave.

All they want to do is just see that you can stabilize in the air and fall on your stomach and touch your handles, make sure you can pitch. That's pretty much it. I mean, they're designed to open. So, like, I'm not trying to downplay it.

I'm sure yes, it is dangerous still jumping out of a plane, but like they're designed to open. you know, they they're they're made to open. Even with some really terrible, horrible pack jobs, they will generally still always open. So, I mean, and you got a backup shoot on them.

You got a reserve. So, it's a thrill. Obviously, I've been chasing a thrill of getting punched in the face for so long. I feel like my wife at the time was like, he's obviously not going to do that forever.

I'll try and see if I can get him something else, maybe to fill that fill that void, you know? So has definitely been filling the void for me. So it's awesome. You might you might give me that spot cuz I want to do it.

I want to do the actual course. Um do let's go. Yeah, I will. Yeah.

I I I love that stuff. It's definitely Yeah, it's good fun. Last time I did it was probably 12 months ago. We're at Jurien.

I've done it about three three times. I think I think one of the times I went back the next day. Done it again. Yeah.

I love it. Love it. The feeling. I'll be your outside camera this time.

Yeah. hope. So I'll hang out the plane. That would be good.

Look at you. Let's do it. We can hold our hands in the air if you feel comfortable. We can kiss in the air as well if you feel comfortable with that.

We can have that hug hug in the air. Let go. We should um I should go do it and then we should this check in 6 months later that I do months. Let's take the Let's take this.

Let's do it and and do it up there. Perfect. I I've always wanted to go do it properly and do it more consistent. And the consistency is the key.

I'm hopeless of consistency, right? But that it's like I wanted to do actually do my chop license as well. But that jumping out of a plane, I don't know whether I got a little bit fearful, but I went and done it again and I'm like it's scary. I don't give you any.

It's scary. It's scary. You know, the closest you feel alive is to death. The scariest bit is before just before you jump.

Yeah. Well, you see it all. Yeah. It's the same with anyone.

Like I've taken big groups up from the gym and you see it all the time. as soon as you you open the door and then when you open the door you go you go get the bench seats and you turn you look you see the people on the bench seats and then it's not until the first like first person leaves all the people that are on that bench that see the people leave cuz the people on the other side can't really see them leave once you see the depth perception of how quick you fall out of the sky you see their faces like go from like that to like you get they get pretty you can just see it straight away so I obviously enjoy it. So I just if I recommend doing so you do it no problem now. Oh no.

Like I if I haven't gone for a while like you said currency is definitely a big thing. And like if you want to talk about deaths or injuries or anything that goes on like any injuries or deaths that happen, you know, get sent to me cuz I have my license. Anyone that has any anybody that has a license gets sent, you know, a coroner's report within like a description of what happened. This person has really severely injured themselves or maybe potentially they've died.

And it's it's all sports jumpers. It's all people just trying to thread the needle just a little bit more and they're all landings. All of the deaths are land are they? So the past three and a half years or whatever have been jumping.

So it's not shoots not coming out or they've all opened. They've all opened. It's just them coming to land. So some it's generally swooping.

So they're coming in hooking in you know coming in at anywhere between I don't know 80. That is such a good feeling. Well, they're coming in pretty fast and all they do is have to, you know, misjudge your altitude by a little bit and they hit the ground and see you later. So, is that right?

Yeah. So, generally that's where the currency's at. So, if you're not going enough on that regard, then the landing is going to be your issues. But it's so addictive in the sense of just trying to improve on in the sky cuz there's so many skills and maneuvers and things you can do in the air that don't seem like they're much but they're super difficult.

So you can do a lot of practice at the tunnel that's here. Yeah, I was about to say do you go to iFly? Yeah, I go there as much as I can. I've been there a fair bit.

Just get in there and it's harder than you think. Like once you go a bit but like you said that that's what I thought of straight away. iFly, like when I went there to try and actually learn properly like the little bit of movement of your body and you're like yeah shoot yeah so and then you throw you know incorporate having a parachute on your back and it adds things makes things a little more difficult an object yeah so that's cool man 6 months well I I I can go up sooner but yeah it'd be good if our recap something like that cuz I'm trying to do remote I'm actually going to the cafe to Simone next week to do the podcast I'm going to go down south for one over east golf course. I'm going to do one in barley.

So, I'm going to start doing some remote ones. Yeah, I reckon. Yeah, it's cool. Just try and break it up than just being here and um or in people's stores or, you know, really turn it up.

But, uh jump in a plane. I don't know which bit we do, but we could cut a bit of it in. Definitely got to put that in there. Yeah.

How good would it be? You're screaming. Save me. Yeah.

So, uh so I touched on that was one thing I want to touch on. you brought it up. The other thing is like what's moving forward now, man? We've we've peeled back a few layers there and couple of close points to to you, but with the barn, with the fam, I don't know.

My kids take up so much our time now just cuz they're just doing so many like they're doing extracurricular activities after school. So, what do they do? A net, dancing. What's my son do now?

Kids sport where they do like a different sport each week. So, one one week they do cricket, then soccer, then they get to try a few. He tried a few different things and then you know he obviously goes daddy I like this you know. Y and then we do like Jimaru which is little you know stuff for Yeah.

So they're all doing different stuff like that just at the gym and I'm been plumbing a little bit more lately which is not ideal cuz I hate it but um going to do what you got to do. What do you have to do at the barn if I can stop the plumbing like? Uh what's the next 10 years for the barn you reckon? Similar to the conversation we had previously for this camera being on as I'd like to just not be in it as much.

Oh yeah. Like I'm in it a lot like I'm taking you know most of the classes I'm like I'm trying to do. What's the biggest challenge? Getting really good coaches or consistency or um or you letting go or No, I've gotten pretty good at letting go now.

Yeah. Let go of the letter run so the next one can come with that. I'm pretty good with that. It's more so it's not something you can, you know, like these computers are sitting over here or whatever.

You know, you can teach people as they're going along, but it's hard to you can't teach someone 100 fights. Y 20 fights, 30 fights, 50 fights or, you know, you see it you see it all the time. I've seen it many, many times just even just within like people coaching or even in the ring or in the corner like cornering someone. You can't fake you can't fake that feeling.

And I don't know how to explain it to you. like when I I could probably pinpoint a few different occasions in my fight career where I've like I needed to win the next round or like I was down or or I really needed to rise above and the pep talk you got beforehand. You can't fake that pep talk. You know what I mean?

Like you either you can tell whether that person's been there or hasn't, you know, like, "Hey bud, listen, I know how you're feeling. When he's doing this, you got to try and do that. This is the time to rise." You know, like for me, just for me, my perspective, if the person hasn't at least done a little bit of it or been in those shoes, it's hard to not not necessarily had the respect, but it's hard to want to push forward. Do you mean like coaching a fighter or do you mean just doing your classes?

just I would say that in a coaching you know even like even I don't know even taking classes you know like I'm not ever going to try and someone but like how I would say coach a a class or explain things probably comes across fairly confident y only because being in this position hey or like you there's 100 ways to skin the cat so a lot of gyms which I would dare say are very narrowminded in the sense of you have to do it like this, you know, and I just totally disagree because what works for me might not work for you, you know, and a lot of gyms are very you have to do it like this. And that that's just not my philosophy that I I run with a bit more of a you know, there's techniques that I still do today that my coaches hate. Yeah. Don't do that.

But I haven't been hit yet, so I haven't been put to sleep or like it's worked for me now. So, hey, if it's working, then roll it. Yep. If you get clipped, then that's on you.

Yeah. So, so going back to my question earlier and because we ended up backtracking which worked out really well, but the disciplines, tell us about the different disciplines because you haven't just done MMA. You started MMA, you said. Started MMA then went off into Muay Thai kickboxing.

I did that for ages. I love that so much. Do you? Oh, I did.

I hate it now. So painful. Can't believe I love Actually, it was Jackson, I think, that was talking about it the other day and he's like, was it Jackson? And he's like, I talked to Wes and it was about kickboxing.

He goes, I love kicking but I hate being kicked. He reckons you said it's like you could have one you could fight one round in Muay Thai or kickboxing and you walk away so sore. You have like one round in an MMA or boxing. You're not really that sore.

It's just like it's just battering the body so much. So yeah, it's definitely it's just painful. So I'm good mates with one thing Ma told me Marcus would give up. I think he said to me one of probably the hardest discipline and it's the the training for it is wrestling 100%.

He goes, "It is." No one understands. No one likes doing it. Freestyle maybe not the warm up to it. The Yeah.

Not so much probably jiu-jitsu, but like freestyle wrestling or Rome Greco wrestling, anything like that. All of those are I would like my boys to do those just just because you just like you just become so athletic. Yeah, man. I would go to Gladiators, which is a place in Molly, and I would go do a heap of like their wrestling class a few years ago, and they would do the warm up, and the warm up would go for like half an hour, 40 minutes.

And I like, "All right, sick. Great session. I'll see you all next week." And like, "No, we still got to wrestle after this, man. What the?" That's what M was saying the same.

It's It's pretty brutal. So it I would definitely recommend if you want your boys to be tough, do some wrestling for sure. Yeah. He reckons the warm up was specifically what he said.

I think he was in hospital. I went and seen him when he had not and his mate come in which was his wrestling coach I think at his gym and not talking about they're like no one likes to wrestling warm up definitely. Yeah, it's definitely a different ball game to say you know BJJ or anything like that. So So what else did you do fightwise?

MMA, Muay Thai, boxing, and boxing. What's uh what's one of your biggest fights that really resonate with you and really kick J? And I don't mean win or lose. I just mean like that was I don't know.

Yeah. What's one that stands out out of theund and something? I'm not talking about fighting with your seven-year-old daughter either. All right.

Um where'd you get flogged? Where did I get I've never been knocked out, haven't you? I've been put on my ass though. Oh, I don't know.

That's a tough one. Probably winning my first Australian Muay Thai title. That was a really, really hard fight. I got fight of the year, actually.

I got split from to breakfast. He like he elbowed. That's what I want to hear. He split me so many times at elbows.

I think I got I think it was like 16 stitches. Yeah, he split my face up pretty bad. And I had to dig deep in that fight and like the whole you know super generic conversation at the end of the you know before the last round you know trying G up and yeah and you know I was down on the cars not doing well I started well and then got split up and then yeah diced up a little bit and then pretty much came down in the last round and I was in his hometown so it wasn't going to look where was this? This was in Queensland.

Yep. Cowboy Central. And then yeah I won that one. So I'd probably say that one.

And that one was definitely character building. And it was good to know in the sense of uh probably more so now in the way that I would train and get ready for competition now or fights. It's more so like I know that I can go there. I know that I can go to the dark place if I need to.

I just don't want to go there as much anymore only because I just like I just can't recuperate. So sometimes younger BS put it on me and I'm obviously my ego and my competitive is like you. Let's go. Let's go.

And I can generally uh just through experience probably get the better of them majority of the time. I just can't back out the next day or two and they're ready to go like four hours later. We do a go again and I'm like yeah that's probably the biggest. Uh so Queensland whereabouts in Queensland was it?

That fight was in Logan. In Logan. What promotion was it? Can you remember?

No idea. So fight of the year. That's pretty cool, man. That was a good fight.

And it's good. You answered all my questions like I got split up. Yeah. fight of the year and I built resilience and character like Yeah.

How with a piece of metal that really means nothing but means something to me. So yeah, of course it does. How long ago was that? How old were you?

A I knew you wouldn't want this question, but I don't like these questions cuz I don't know. I just It gets in your timeline. I would have been roughly 23. Oh yeah.

Okay. Yep. 23 24. So you come out to Perth 18, started training in one and then Y then you went down a bit of that.

Where where were you training then to do that? Still at M1. Yeah. Oh, you were?

Yeah. I was going to touch on this before. I don't know how, but he's he's got a really good name, eh? Yeah.

He's been around for been around a long time. Been around forever. He's had a lot of people come in and out of his gym. Yeah.

He's been doing his thing. Yeah. It's um when you've been doing it that long, it's hard for majority of people not to know you or know of the things that your gym or your business has done. So, yeah, if you he who refuses to give up cannot lose.

So, yep. So, yeah, definitely wrong with that. Doesn't quit. Yeah, that's right.

Do a lot of you fighters do you only ever catch up at um like promotions and stuff or do you talk a lot or have you got some you're closer than others? Yeah, like I got a few boys businesses and coaches. Uh yeah, I got a few boys that obviously have I've trained with for god knows how long and we still chat like daily. Yeah, like generally from a group chat, which is obviously I would not show my wife any of Yeah.

So, yeah, we talk. We're all pretty tight. All want to see each other do well and all trying to help each other. So, you know, always trying to sharpen each other's sword in some respect of always trying to get together.

When someone's got a fight coming up, we generally try and get around with each other and try and help when we can. So, I mean, it's nice to How many How many fighters you had lately jump in on any of the promotions? Uh, I got a guy Danny at the barn who's like pretty much like kind of head coaching most of the guys now. He's got a fair few guys that jump in um Domination, which is the Domination MMA side of things.

Mhm. Probably start branching into some kickboxing, I reckon. Oh, we are. Got a couple of guys there that are pretty good.

Wouldn't mind chucking them in. Yeah. Yeah. See how we go.

They haven't had a fight. Not yet. Oh, so you give them that. No, it's more so like I know how much coach meant to me.

Not more so like early on, you know, like they become they come everything to you. Like they're your your psychologist, they're your dietician, they're your bloody therapist, they're your shoulder to cry on, they're your person lifts you up, brings you down, puts you in check. You wear a lot of hats. That's the standard I would like to be held to.

And for the time being, you know, maybe not so much now, but definitely slightly previously, I just I'm investing too much time into myself still wanting to do it. And I just wouldn't want to let someone down like that just because I know how much it meant to me. And that's the standard that I would like to uphold. So that's some wicked values, man.

If I can't hold that standard, I don't I wouldn't want to commit. I don't want to commit to someone like that. So definitely something that I would want to do in the future. Yeah, I think I'd do good at it.

Like coaching them into more fights. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Well, like you said before, man, there's there's a couple of things you said. You talked earlier about um that pep talk or that in between rounds and that and then you just brought up your fight of the year and you said basically and that must resonate like just before the last round or something you said you had to dig deep. Yeah. Like it's not even anything.

It's not even anything. There's no rocket science. It's just like someone's looking you in the eyes. I know you saw.

I know you're tired. Get the back in there. Are you tired, son? You know, and like I know that he would have hurt cuz he like I've seen, you know, the fights like he's been there, you know, and and just try and g you up, you know.

Listen, this isn't forget forget anybody's forget this. This isn't about anyone here. This is for you. The next 3 minutes is for you.

Gives you that little all that all that hard work you've done. This is it. Show me you want it or something along those lines, you know, and that just brings you up. So, how's um just a bit left field.

How's Ben Vicers won? He stepped forward. What did he say again? Keep pinging the Keep pinging the That's super scientific though.

How good was that? Um that's Ben. Ben. So, um it was gold actually.

It was uh it was Yeah. Good moment. And the the other one uh I think you said yeah I think you're just talking about how close your coach is and and the team back and you going in you know like I could see you you know with your values which you're really passionate about like that's what you emphasize on every time we're talking about the gym like you go get a couple of fighters and you commit like you said you don't want to yeah like getting that you need a big team your your thing would be getting everyone to make sure that they're 300% behind them like that you're already off to a good start right just be tight just you know how many people does it going into fight camp and all that the support besides family and friends and you know it's the focus bit right training I personally don't think I personally don't think you need a big team y the biggest thing is going to be bodies for you to work on things and different looks for yourself so it's amazing that there's actually quite an array of say MMA guys that are coming out of Perth that are like kind of breaking into the scene for UFC which is like crazy cuz we're the That's isolated place. I know.

I think the ratio like I remember 8 months ago Cam talking about like the ratio of Perth. Yeah. Like per capita per you know whatever it is off the charts. I don't know what it is but even saying that the just the amount of bodies that are here aren't a lot like everybody knows everyone.

You know what I mean? Like and that is the fight scene in any scene in general. you don't have a massive array of people to grab and use as different bodies to, you know, get ready for this guy, get ready for that guy. So, the biggest thing that I would say is you don't need a big team.

Find yourself a coach that genuinely actually cares about you and wants to see you do well. A lot of coaches just chuck in just to chuck you in, and that's fine. That's just what they're there for. If you find one that you resonate with that really you feel wants to see you do better or actually just cares about you.

I would I would latch on to that as hard as I possibly can. Yeah. The care factor. You don't even need to be I mean you don't even have to be that amazing skill-wise as a coach.

But if you believe and have a lot of care and just want to show up when it counts for your fighter, I feel like that's probably the biggest one. Yeah. Yeah. biggest nugget.

Is Is MMA still your main love or main one that you No, I don't know. Well, I think the last fight I had was boxing, but I don't know. I definitely don't definitely do not I used to love Muay Thai. That was my thing, but that's too painful.

It hurts too much. It's not my thing anymore. Where'd you box last? Uh Melbourne.

It was Melbourne. Melbourne. Yeah. Where was it before then?

Adelaide. Yeah. I was going to say cuz I was talking to someone the other day and they said they mentioned you in the fight in Adelaide I think. Yeah.

I can't remember. Might have been Jackson or whatever. He fought the same guy. Yeah.

Well, that maybe he was main event. He was that's why we're talking about it. Yeah. He fought uh I can't remember.

Jamel Herring. Yeah. Okay. Yeah.

American bloke. Yeah. Yeah. That's why we were talking about it.

That's why your name come up. Yeah. Adelaide. Yeah.

That was good fun. It was good. It was good. Yeah.

That was good fun. That was good fun. Do you like Adelaide? It's a fight.

Yeah, it's a fight. I can't I didn't really say much of Adelaide. Adelaide's just heaps of churches, isn't it? loads of there as well.

Yeah. Yeah. Both of them pretty much. What um fight camps, just for a bit of curiosity and education for me, uh fight camps, boxing to MMA, what's the difference?

Obviously the style of it. I would say boxing is way easier. Is it? Well, it just takes up less time.

So, bless you, cat. Oh, I think gorgeous. Um I would say probably boxing just takes up less your time. Obviously with MMA, you're doing so many more elements of the game.

Yeah. Grappling, kicking, punching. And what I learned probably off Macka as well, obviously being close mates and he's taught me over the years, just from a business perspective, the whole MMA thing like like we're talking about team before, you might go train with one guy obviously for the grappling and another guy for the standup and you know what I mean? Like well that's another thing.

So you're taking up the resources there and but you got to find the right people. Well, man, sometimes you can go to the one gym and that can that can happen for you. You can have someone that has done it all and can somewhat facilitate all those elements. But a lot of the time I feel like uh coaches maybe I don't know if it's an ego thing but feel maybe a little bit incompetent cuz they can't they can't do some of those areas and they don't want to let their fighter or their guy go there in case they might lose them or there's a lot of this want to keep them close all the time you know and you don't let them you got to let them spread their wings because everyone's different.

You got to go to you have to go different places. You have to get different looks, different feels. So, well, even even your key guys that have come out of Perth, like you know, Steve and Jack and all that, they they all they all get around the different people suits. Like, I didn't realize that till Macka told me, he's like, "Yeah, man.

like we all, you know, we might be all separate gyms and all that stuff all link up to some and and the more chats I have, especially doing this. It's like just how much everyone is I know WA's already two degrees, but just everyone there's not I've never really heard any bad words or anything, everyone supports everyone. Like even go back a couple of years when I hung out with Ben a bit more like even from the promotion side, you know, to the gyms like helping each other out and it's really cool. It is.

I mean, maybe because Perth is quite a bit smaller maybe. Oh, it is like I think every industry imp like that. Yeah, maybe that might be this. Maybe that might be it.

I don't know. I got to um I'm going to ask you something. You don't have to answer it. So, every time you say this, you're not going to answer it.

So, no. No, because I I can't remember what it was, but I was told a story about you overseas. Well, here we go. Yeah.

And I think we've talked about this. So, Dave Flet and Dan. So, you know Flety. I know Flety pretty well.

And your name come up and I think he's all went on a trip a long time ago. Who's Who's to America? No, I actually can't remember, but I I've never brought it up with you because I haven't thought of it and I haven't seen you, but I remember FY telling me I'm in here. It was a lad's trip somewhere.

I don't know. Bucks party. Yeah, it might have been a bucks. I think it would have been in Thailand.

Was Thailand? Yes. You're talking about me. What did you do?

Talking about blowing up the inflatable thing. Yeah, that might have been it. Actually, that was that trip was so tell us about it. Can we talk about the best man for my mate's wedding?

Yeah. And we gone over Thanks. We gone over to Koh Samui. So there's like that's what it was.

Flety would never even know. There's like there's like 14 of us or something that went over and as soon as we landed everyone kind of dispersed like we got like a I got a scooter as soon as we got everyone got scooters as soon as we got there. And then we were on the piss like pretty early straight away even on the plane over there. So we were pretty merry.

Yeah. And then we landed, chuck our bags down, and then it hadn't even been an hour. I'd been on the island and we drove I crashed my scooter. So then I left it, but I was all the way down the beach.

So I had to walk all the way back. So the guy was on the back with me just we crashed together. So we started walking back, little spoon, left. So, I'm walking along the beach and as we're walking along the beach out in the ocean, they they shut it down because that was the end of the day or the weather wasn't that great or something and it was this big inflatable playground.

But what they did is they tied all the apparatuses together and it was ages out and then we end up seeing two other boys that were on the Bucks party but they stopped at one of those little bloody hut. Yeah. Places that sell piss on the side of the bridge. Hey, what's going on?

And then they pretty much said you won't swim out there, Cap. And I was like, no way. It was miles away and then something as simple as like I know you wouldn't puff. I was like still got my out and I swam all the way out there and then it took me ages to get out there.

I finally got out there and there was a reason why they timed together cuz they're all like all one big mass. Yeah. When they open when they open in the mornings they were there to spread out and they're really far apart. Anyway, cut long story short, I I actually this is I'm not trying to talk it up, but I pretty close to I nearly died.

Yep. Cuz I climbed up this pyramid thing and I thought it'd be sick if they'd seen me from the shore. I'd do this flip and I did this tried to do this flip onto the trampoline. So, there was a trampoline element on the water, but there was a I'm picturing this.

So, I'm on the top of this dome and I jumped off to try and do this flip, but I lost my footing. And when I lost my footing, I landed on the side of the trampoline which burst the apparatus and obviously and it started sinking. But then my foot had got stuck into it as it's sinking and it started pulling me down. So I'm like trying to rip my foot out thing sucking me.

I I my brick. I bricks, mate. And I finally come up for for air and then was like holy I knew this died. And then I swam all the way back.

And then once I got back, I would have Yeah. This is This is how smart the tires are. They followed us. So we had walked a couple of KS back to our hotel which was on the beach and they knew we were Well, they must have followed us.

Y So then we finally got back to our rooms and we were all in the same on the same level, all like two, three in a room, whatever. And then I was like we're all pretty merry by that stage and it was still daylight. So like as we got back to there, all of a sudden I just got bombarded by like four or five ties coming and grabbing me. You pay for this and I was just like what are you?

I was like like pushing them away and whatever else and all the other guys that all the other boys that were there were like did nothing. And this is a true testament to what mates are for or that's where a true mate is. The groom who didn't know anything had nothing. He had no idea what had happened.

I was in the wrong. He had no idea. He's coming. He started swinging.

There was no no. Yeah. Like push. So he's a big boy as well.

I started pushing this guy out the way, pushing that guy out the way. And then Yeah. In the end, I end up doing like being on the run for like a day and a half cuz I just refused to like Yep. pay them cuz you got to pay this.

I think it started off at about $600 Australian. I was the pay for that. You put a bicycle patch on your pump. You'd be right.

And then um I pretty much just said it wasn't me. Yeah. I was on the run for a little bit and then finally caught up with me cuz I didn't go back to my hotel room cuz I was worried about then come back to that room. So I just went and bunked with one of the other guys at the hotel next door and that's where I pretty much stayed but then I left some of my things in there.

So you know it's like as a bloke I didn't change my shorts. I just wore the same shorts the entire time I was wearing no jocks. I went back to my room and then that's when they came and grabbed me again. They got me again.

So but then I had to pay them off. So I had to pay off the extra. Well, no, cuz then they got border control in as well. So, I had to pay the people who had the inflatable facility.

Then I had to pay the police and I had to pay border border patrol. So, it's like three different lots of payments and I couldn't get all money out of my account cuz it had like limits on their little ATM there. So, all the end and at the end of I think it cost me like $1,750 and I had to borrow money from a few of the guys. Two of the guys had to go take money out for me and then I had to steamroll from me borrowing money from four different guys.

I borrow money off Flety. So borrow money off Flety, Lakesie and a couple two other guys. Whose wedding was it? It was Dan Daniel.

Oh yeah. Yeah. So his wedding and then Yeah. Flet was on the Yeah.

He was there anyway. Yeah. That was an expensive trip. Worth it though.

That was good fun. We're still talking about it now. A cuz when when we worked out I don't know why your name come up ages ago. Probably a year or two ago.

I was with having a beer and he's like, "Yeah, Dan's really close with actually lived with each other for quite a few years and then we live around the corner from each other for a few years and now we both moved house but didn't like didn't discuss. We knew we were both like buying like a new like another house somewhere else." Yeah. And now we live around the corner from each other again, but just not that was only just by chance. Oh.

So, yeah. Funny how it works, isn't it? Man, they're good lads. Hey, I've only I've only met Dan a couple of times and I know Flety pretty well.

And um yeah, they're good good lads. And when I heard that, I'm like, good story. And and I could I remember Flety told me something. I couldn't I thought it was like Thailand or Bali or something like that.

Yeah, it was a trip. Thanks, buddy. Yeah, dude. And I and I if I knew more, I probably wouldn't have said much because I didn't know whether you I couldn't I couldn't remember the outcome and I'm like maybe we don't want to share this.

I reckon what we do is we we wrap it up and um I this is something significant that I don't know that you want to share. And it doesn't have to be boxing. No, I don't. I reckon what we do is cuz I go back and watch all these, right?

And then obviously we launch them. It'll probably be 3 4 weeks cuz I got a few there. But um I I really like now cuz I'm doing an event uh down at Embassy probably the 2nd or the 12th of November for all the guests and people going to come on and we're going to video and do a mini podcast. have Jerry there shucking with these.

We're going to take the whole lot down at the foreign exchange. But that that check-in bit I'm really um like going down the rabbit hole with it. So I think what we'll do offline is me and you can talk over the next couple of months and do that whole skydive thing, man. It'll be wicked.

Sounds even better. And do a bit of a recap and then cuz I go back and watch this and I'll pull a couple of points out and then go, "Hey, let's chat about that." It could be a shorter one. Yeah. And um and just see how things are going like on the journey, you know, from from today.

So, it's been two. It's probably been longer than two years. Probably been 3 years. But I'm not good with years as you know.

As I know, how long ago was the bucks? That's what I was going to ask you cuz I knew you wouldn't want to answer it. Yeah. Ages.

10 years. 8 years at least. Yeah, something like that. I thought it was.

Yeah, I would say 10 years probably. So, two things. What'd you get out of today? Got to have a good chat.

I uh I'm probably going to leave here and process a little bit of the whole um the parenting thing that uh man I'd chat any time about that stuff offline too. That uh that I'll have a bit of think about that cuz I've obviously same similar thing to your whole um eating your cactus thing. I've done quite a few some guided and some solo okay psychedelic um trips just to see if I could just unravel some things and stuff's come up that I didn't think was going to come up and wasn't going to be a big deal but was a big deal for me. So that has helped in some regard.

But that is a good little thinker little little head twister for me. I like little I like little think I I didn't know obviously me and you never spoke about that stuff before so obviously it resonates with you. Go watch Gordy, the Canadian guy, the yellow shirt about I met him at the cafe on a Monday, had him on the podcast on a Wednesday from Canad. It touches on that heaps and like he's he's got really bad thoughts, gone through a lot.

Just listen to the whole It's right off story and and a lot of it you'll resonate with with the whole he went and done a solo and researched cuz he couldn't help. Yeah. Anyway, I'll let you watch it. Yeah, do that.

And um and it'd be good one day we catch up the next month or so and maybe I'll come to Jurien with you or something and we just chat about I'll tell you about that whole experience I had with that cactus like the four knots that come out like the 16 hours was I won't talk about it now we'll wrap it up but it was epic man. The first one was and I was more ready for the first one. The second one I took ma actually and his partner and another guy I know that it's all about the intention right the days coming up to it and I don't think I was as ready. I just had an argument with the chick I was with and I just I think I didn't not drink for 3 days and eat cuz you're not meant to eat and and I don't think I done that right.

So I learned a lot about that intention but it kept me up all night. I learned patience was different to the first one. The first one changed my world and I learned a lot about off the guy the next morning about sitting in your own. So as in like emotion and I I do a lot of that now and I more than I ever have and I wouldn't waste a minute in the day.

I'd always be with someone to do something. And that moment, that night, that next day, that taught me to go and eat by myself. I'll go to a restaurant, eat by myself. I'll sit at home by myself now.

Still not where I want to be because you're still avoid. It's all avoidance, right? And feeling% and you know this. So, it be good to good to chat about one day.

Um I think now that I know you're similar wavelength there, especially with the whole parenting thing, like there's so much processing in that and it's and we only know what we know. Let's ride the wave. Let's go. All right.

Next one. So that's awesome that you got that out of that, man. If I get one nugget or resonation with one and usually not your occupation, it's usually a personal thing. I love that.

Right. Fills my cup. But the next thing is who who could I one or two people I could get on or get you to intro me to if I don't know them to have on here. Yeah.

I always ask this at the end cuz I get me team to noted down and follow it up. And Jeez, you put me on the spot. Yeah. And they don't have to be this guy or this.

There's no everyone's equal. Everyone's like it doesn't matter who they are. It's like, and this is the best thing about this. It's the compound network.

So good. I don't know. Who do you want to do in the Get get Malcolm Day on him? Malcolm Day?

Yeah. Yeah. He'd be a good one, wouldn't he? Would he Did What's he like?

Does I don't know him really well, but does he share his story a lot? No, I don't know. You reckon he would? Do you know him really well?

I don't know. Uh, I used to catch up with him and play chess. Oh, did you? Are you a chess player?

I used to love playing chess. doesn't play pages, but like he had heard that I enjoyed playing and I hadn't seen him for a few years and then yeah, we go to Scarborough and play chess. Wow. A few weeks.

He's that thing that I asked you earlier. What's something about you? We don't know. chess.

Not now. I'm terrible. But yeah, Malcolm. No, go Malcolm Day.

He's got he's colorful. Yeah. Different. And Perth.

In Perth that this is what I love, right? Like obviously I I do obese and I'll do international but the whole Perth base building a foundation of the podcast now is really critical right because my networks and this is the compounding maybe I'll get you to give me an intro like sure I've you know spoke to and met him numerous times but not not like chess with him so yeah that's cool that was a bit of a left field one I was expecting someone else but hear about some stories from him no doubt a he's yeah he's got the journey is he it' be it'd be cool because there's a few people locked in this I locked in about 10 this week, right? So, I probably probably got 2/3 of the rest of the year done. I got a list of like 240.

And we go through and prioritize and and then I might run into someone I haven't seen pages. They're not even on the list and they'll be like, "I love the podcast." And I'm like, "Just come on next week and I'll do two in a week." And once again, not too formal. So, yeah, mate. Wicked.

I'm stoked. Exactly. I didn't know what it'll be like. And I thought there'd be a bit of banter and jokes, but I'm going to go away and process even our chat about the whole family and dad, you know, being a parent and role model.

And it's amazing, man. It's cool. And this is what I love out of it. You'll go home, you look forward to the thing time, me time, alone time.

Yeah. Are you Are you a lot of I'm trying to be better at it now. Yeah. Yeah.

Cuz when you when you're that dopamine chaser or that adrenaline chaser, you're not really good at it. You avoid constantly, right? employees are just motorbikes, jumping, you name it. Avoiding.

Yeah. And I I got told that 5 years ago, right? Like it's all avoidance, Paul. Even starting businesses, going to work and being in the office 15.

I'm like, no, I love it. I know now. Run away from it's like what's your priorities? What moves the needle?

Now it's delete, delete, delete, add back in when it suits. 100%. All right. All right.

It's done. Cheers. Thank you.